Windows vs Linux…. The ultimate waste of time…
I learned something today.... something I have perhaps taken for granted until now. Well two things really....
- You don't need to have any realistic IT knowledge to work in IT... Your logic need not be sound and reasonable... You simply have to be able to "do your job"
- That anyone can get a blog... and they don't always present the user with realistic information.
I got up early this morning (girlfriend misplaced her keys and I had to lock the door behind her)... so I figured I'd head to work early... I'd get ready, have a bite to eat and check out my RSS Feeds. One of them, the Infopackets.com Windows Newsletter, had a new article posted. It turned out that this article was a rehash from a blog called "The Handicapped Computerist". I must say I like the concept... a place on using computers with a disability by people with disabilities and an IT background... the information, sorry, misinformation that is being presented is what I have a problem with... Let's call it FUD.
The last 6 posts to this blog have been Windows vs Linux posts and why Linux is better... The poster, Doug, had apparently spent 38 years in IT and is a Unix SysAdmin. In these 6 posts he makes the following arguments (each point represents 1 post)
- The first blog post tells us about how malware (viruses, trojans, spyware, etc) is virtually non-existant on Linux... This isn't because Windows is more popular because if were all due to popularity then Apache would have more exploits available than IIS. Linux also has "Smart Authorization Management" which is why it's safe from malware... you need Administrator or "root" permissions to make changes, Windows just lets everyone make changes. Lastly flaws... because Linux has 1000s of developers and many testers the flaws are dealt with quickly. Oh yeah and new software requests are filled in a day or two...
- Linux is more stable. Doug had a dev system run for 3 years without failure, Windows by comparison requires weekly reboots.
- Malware again... And an option this time: Install a Firewall and AV, replace IE and Outlook with Firefox and Thunderbird or install Linux (and sleep soundly at night). Because of the immense man power behind Linux flaws are patched immediately, you seldom wait more than a day or two... compared to once a month for Windows
- 1/4 of what you spent on that new computer actually went to paying for Windows (I'd like to note at this time that nothing on these posts was backed up with evidence, it was all just randing) but Linux is completely free... and Microsoft could change their mind at any time and start charging you an annual subscription fee.
- I'm getting tired of typing all of these out..... but on we go.... This fifth blog posting again confuses Linux and the OSS movement as being one in the same... and while tied, they are not the same... Then it covers the "freeness" of Linux again... and then more on Updates.. You can select your Linux updates but not your Windows updates... and so forth...
- This last post, so far, discusses updates yet again... This time how Windows only covers Windows but Linux covers third party applications..
Alrighty.... problems with all of this.... but first... for anyone reading these blogs.... Blog 6 refers to YUM as the Yellow Dog Update Manager... It's actually "Yellowdog Updater Modified"...
Problems:
- Malware exists for Linux.... just as it exists for Macs... There simply isn't a market for malware authors yet... Some exists... just as security flaws exist... However why not target the largest and "dumbest" user base... Which is the Windows market. The comparison of it isn't just a market issue because Apache has fewer exploits than IIS is a moot point.. I ran a search on Security Focus.. Apache has 160 BIDs associated with it, IIS has only 130... so Apache does have more exploits.
- Smart Authorization Management.... Meaning you don't run as admin all the time.... Most malware is drive by downloads and crap that people pick up by visiting websites.... This software has the ability to run because most Windows users run their computers as Administrator all the time.... You would start to experience the same problem if all Linux users were running as root all the time... The users want simplicity to install software and easy of use... Which is why they run in such an insecure way... they'd do the same if you presented them with Linux... Windows 'runas' and Linux 'sudo' aren't enough to appease them.
- Flaws are not always dealt with quickly... and Linux is not synonymos with OSS... they are two different things and flaws are not always dealt with quickly... Take this recent nVidia problem.... it's existed since 2004 depending on which account you read.. The OSS driver is patched but not the vendor binary...
- New software requests are not fulfilled by Linux but by the OSS community and this is just misleading... Seldom can you say... I want this and two days later someone would return it... However, in case this is true.. I want a WoW3 client for Linux that has all the functionality of the original WoW3 but will let me play online without a subscription
. - Linux is not "more stable".... stability all comes with experience... The more inexperienced the user, the more open to crash the system is... I've had Windows boxes with uptimes of more than a year... I had a roommate in college that had an uptime on a Windows 95 machine of close to two years... In comparison one of my Linux boxes, due to a mass storage driver problem that I've yet to find time to fix, will crash as soon as I plug a mass storage device into the USB port.. This is just more misleading people...
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Next we suggest that you have to install a plethora of security software.... or Linux... Most Linux users I know run a firewall.. be it iptables or ipchains depending on their kernel... Many also have ClamAV installed as an AV solution... yet users are being told that they won't need this.... I also like the quote to switch from IE to Firefox.... yet we've seen that IE had less vulns than Firefox in the last Symantec Internet Threat Report. (See also this past posting)
- I would have to argue that Linux patches are released faster... You have to remember that Linux is simply the kernel... I'm running SuSE... it's a package around the Linux kernel... It gives me my additional software, it provides me with my patches... If it wasn't for this 3rd party solution for Linux, I'd be required to download and compile the kernel myself everytime a change comes out... Microsoft releases patches on a monthly cycle for a reason... It also makes sense for them to do it.
- I still want to see evidence on Windows costing 1/4 of the cost of a new computer... Regardless the TCO of Linux is generally higher than that of Windows when you add learning curve, training, etc... Software alone, however, can also be responsible (Another past blog posting)
- I'm going to start skipping some of the obvious FUD... Windows Update provides patches for the Windows Operating System... Microsoft Update provides patches for a slew of Microsoft software... Windows, Office, SQL, Exchange.... Included in "Windows" is Internet Explorer, WMP, etc. Linux distributions release patches for all software they ship... This software isn't necessarily "Linux", and these vendors are shipping the updates because Linux distributions have historically maintained full installs with all required software... That's what makes a distribution a distribution and not just the Linux kernel prepackaged... With both Windows and various Linux distributions you CAN select the software you install... there's no requirement that you MUST install an update.... however, it's generally in your best interest to install these updates.
- I'd like to mention that the more "user friendly" distributions that the home user could easily settle into... Traditionally Linspire and SuSE both cost money in the past for the easy of installation.. It's only recently that these user friendly versions have been made freely available in an "easy to install" manner. Several vendors still have paid versions... You pay not for the documentation but for special licensing agreements that they vendor may have to distribute other vendors software in their packages.
I'd also like to point out that Linux is not a point and click install world... It's not a world devoted to ease of use... It still has problems and flaws.... while some distributions are close to being ready for mainstream use, I don't know that any of them truly are. The only users they are good for are Power Users and people who strictly surf the internet and read mail. Many websites that provide custom applications and little tools that users like will only run in Windows and OS X, most games are still designed only for Windows... Open Source applications don't have the support that the big name vendors have, nor do they support the quality.... Which is why you won't find most organizations running Open Office, or most marketing companies running the Gimp...
My only hope is that people reading "The Handicapped Computerist" aren't taken in by the misinformation that is being passed along to them... Hopefully this article (something I really didn't want to do) will make them think twice before turning around and installing Linux based on the lies they have been presented.
Peace,
HT
Although I've mentioned this before... to qualify... At work I use Windows and Linux side by side... My primary desktop at home runs Linux, while my second desktop runs OS X.... I have two additional computers in the house running Linux and only one running Windows. So I'm not some die hard Windows user... I just want people to be informed with correct information.
Hi, HT.
I just discovered your blog and your rant against my articles. I’m sorry you had so many problems with them. If I may, I would like to address your comments (just a couple of them). Firstly, my articles that were published on my personal blog and on Infopackets were done with the full knowledge and agreement of the owner of Infopackets. Lastly, I think my credentials are such that I can speak of Linux with authority. That you disagree is noted. You are entitled to your opinion, of course, but so am I. I provided no misinformation in any of my pieces. I do, however take exception to your not taking the time to write me directly (as I am doing here) to let me know you have a problem with what I wrote. I do think, however, that you have expressed a very narrow view on the subject and I wonder why. Was it your intent to charge me personally and my blog? Next time you disagree with what I write, let me know before leveling your pen at me like this, please.
Doug,
I appreciate you taking the time to come here and respond, even this this was posted back in October. However, all you’ve done is attempted to turn what I’ve said about your blog posts into a personal attack on you, it wasn’t anything of the sort. I was pointing out the problems with your blog posts.
You state that you can ‘speak of Linux with authority’ and that you provided no ‘misinformation’. Did you read my blog post? I’ve very clearly and in detail pointed out misinformation that you’ve given. I don’t know how to further explain it to you if you can’t see it.
The problem with contacting you directly is that others may read the information you provided and accept it as truth… which it isn’t. As you’ve stated in your comment, you see no problem with what you wrote… so how would contacting you first have helped? You would have said, “I can speak on Linux with authority so I’m write and you’re wrong” (which is essentially what you said above). I’ve provided evidence and proof of the misinformation you spread, you can feel free to debate the points but if this is who you are, just stating you’re right because “you are”… then I have no interest in contacting you first to clarify your posts.
Are you serious about a USB device crashing the machine? I don’t think I’ve ever had that problem on any OS. The only time I’ve even seen it happen was when Bill Gates was showing off Windows 98
Hehe.
As for uptime, I think you’ll agree here that uptime on a machine, doesn’t just depend on OS, but also on what that OS is doing. If I boot windows 98, and let it sit there not doing much, it damn well better not crap out, but if I have a little bit of a load running on it, it is probably going to crash. Windows 95 crashing seemed to be pretty easy from the memory leaks that even Microsoft admitted to in an article they took down from their page very quickly, but my FTP server running Slackware seems to do it with ease and it’s OLD.
If I saw a Windows 95 machine running for 2 years without a reboot, I’d have a few things I’d be wondering about. One of those things would be, “Is it doing anything?” And “How many times has this person not installed security patches, since most of them, even for things that shouldn’t require a reboot, like media player installs, are not installed?”.
I think the biggest weapon for Linux UNIX and whatever VS Windows when it comes to uptime is that the only time you need to reboot is when a new Kernel gets installed. Windows needs one for just about every patch except of course that one that basically checks your machine for mal ware and then stops. Which I might add was very smart of them to start doing after the last couple worm outbreaks, which shows Microsoft isn’t stupid. But as I’ve said before, I do think it’s easier to keep a UNIX machine running than a Windows one based soley on not having to reboot for security patches, or any others for that matter, unless the Kernel itself is being patched, and even then, you are rarely required to install all of them because they seem to be local these days.
talk to you later man,
-gore
While I personally use a combination of Windows and Linux
(and I might add something here about that also being a bad idea,
as the last time I combined Windows 7 and Ubuntu 10.10 on a single
machine, I ended up with a corrupted boot sector), I would like to
point out a few benefits, and flaws with BOTH arguments. Firstly,
it is impossible to talk completely about both in a non-biased
manor, as each individual person will have their own preference as
to which they approve of more. HT, first I will say that it is
mostly true that the majority of flaws and security problems affect
Windows simply because it is the most widely used operating systems
in the world. Linux, with its open source content, would, if
anything, pose a greater risk of possible problems, if someone
truly put their skill and enough effort into trying to create worms
and viruses for Linux. Security problems, however, are also in part
held at bay by the simple fact that the majority of Linux users use
several different types of files, depending usually on the type of
Linux, such as SuSE, Fedora, Debian, etc. The fact that any real
programmer with enough experience and know-how could help patch any
security flaws that could appear in Linux, as quickly as possible,
and submit the changes as soon as possible, as opposed to Microsoft
techs, which are more focused on making Windows the most used OS,
and only occasionally dealing with the many troublesome hackers,
worms, trojans, and viruses. May I also point out the video posted
by Microsoft relatively recently where they tried to compare Open
Office and their own Word programs in an
“un-biased” way. They complained about the
buttons, layout, format, and many other things, while it should be
obvious that they could change the layout and most of these other
low-end problems they complained about. As well as showing overall
contempt for the entire program, which I’m sure has
absolutely NOTHING to do with the fact that they could stand to
gain even .001% more sales from the ignorant majority of the public
by saying so. As for the updates you allow on your machines, it is
painfully obvious as to WHY Linux allows you the ability to choose
which ones to install. It would sound as though it would be a
negative aspect to Linux to have to purposely have to go in and
select which updates and installs you would like, while Windows
simply makes you install EVERYTHING including the mass of
completely useless updates, and programs, which can include things
as meaningless as scanning the machine for any malware or
virus’s that your firewall should have blocked anyway and
just scanning to make sure that all of your hardware is licensed to
work with Windows. I would say that both windows and Linux has
their own benefits and drawbacks. However, I believe that the less
ambitious and more productive activity of Linux (despite the
majority of Linux users being extra tech savvy) I would estimate
that a majority change in the majority opinion of Linux, as well as
the gradual downward spiral of Windows, will inevitably cause Linux
to eventually become the most widely used operating system in the
world. Windows does have gaming… Overall, I’d say that
itself is about 95% of the reason that I still use windows…. as
well as the programming classes I take now, sadly, involve having
to use the command prompt. -S.K. Another point, would be
considering the
I have been dabbling in Linux for a while now. I have experience with Windows 95 through Windows 7, I have a Macmini, and currently am just using Windows 7 on my laptop which is an actual PC(seems to be running just as stable as OSX so far and have been using 7 for about 9 months and have been making it work really hard for me, if it were XP it would have crashed LONG AGO with what I have been doing to it). Part of me wants to dive into the command line and into programming, but here is something that NO ONE ever mentions. Why do I personally want to “dive into” Linux full force like I do? Get a PC that is UNIX based that runs like OSX and NOT SPEND ANY MONEY ON THE OS…did I just say that? Think about that for just a minute. I buy a 700 dollar laptop(assuming I want to put Linux on a brand new computer which I personally want to because of blu ray drive or burner, HDMI out with 1080p output, USB 3.0 etc etc etc), without paying for my software. If I had spent only 300 dollars more I could have bought a Macbook with the SAME ABILITIES(albeit with the bugs worked out of the basic software, no driver issues out of the box, yes big brother is on my ass being that it is Apple with their iron fist on their source code, not to mention the annoying religious zealouts who don’t know what the hell they are talking about who follow the Apple religion), and yet did I REALLY pay for OSX.whatever? Or did I pay Apple to work the bugs out of something that is similar to Linux and merely buy the machine off of them with the software already on it since I have to have a Mac to run OSX in the first place(legally)? Think about that for just a minute. One way or the other I have to pay for something. If I had an issue with not being able to look at the code for OSX, then I could see this as a problem. I personally don’t care cause I’m not a programmer. If I was then this would be a REALLY BIG DEAL. One way to think about this is do these companies really want people looking at the source code for these programs they spend millions or perhaps hundreds of millions of dollars towards research and development only to have people copy just enough not to get sued by Apple or Microsoft? If I were Billy boy or Steve Jobs I sure the hell wouldn’t want just any old joe schmoe to be able to look at the code my company had created for my 130 or 300 dollar OS that is lining my pockets. Do I personally think that software should be free? Yes. Do I wish that everything was Open Source and that these big companies were a thing of the past? Absolutely. On the flip side, if I pay just a little more for my hardware do I need to invest the time to get my computer to run as stable as I want it to run so I can focus on things like mastering the Piano, picking up on women, Lucid dreaming, learning how money ACTUALLY works, mastering self control, etc etc etc? You can bet your bottom dollar that is my kind of idea…just some things to think about. If I wasn’t good at an instrument(was classically trained on the Piano and currently starting on my music degree, played Bassoon in high school, played bass for about 8 years but quit to focus on Piano, played the Violin for seven years, but the Piano still sticks with me and I only want to play, not produce and have been playing since I was 3-am 32 now) then for me I would have to master C++, or Java, or C#, maybe Javascript, Python, Perl, or whatever language or scripting language suits your fancy. But being that I am just gonna play music, go out performing, maybe become a Suzuki Piano teacher or make my own school, I think I’ll probably just get a Macbook(I’ll just nod and keep my mouth shut if a fanboy is badmouthing another OS and just stay out of the debate because part of me no longer cares, all OS’s have there good points and bad points, and I think sometime in the future Linux may become the OS of choice, just not now in 2011. Maybe closer to 2050 if things keep going the way they are). That will be the day…